Choir Baton Podcast Episode 2. Student Teaching: Getting to Know You

Lamar Davis and Nyi Nyi Myin, two senior Music Education majors at Wingate University just outside Charlotte, NC, are about to start their student teaching experience. In this episode, Beth asks why and how they came to choral music, why they chose Wingate, and what they are looking forward to in choral music student teaching. 

Choir Baton Host: @bethphilemon | www.bethphilemon.com

Choir Baton: @choirbaton | www.choirbaton.com

Choir Baton Theme Song by Scott Homes 

Lamar Davis: Because imperfection is something that we've learned to exploit and to see no matter if the rest of the three minute song was amazing, the two seconds where that high note didn't come out like it was supposed to is what's going to be playing over and over in our heads.

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Beth Philemon: Welcome to the Choir Baton, a podcast designed to engage with people and stories, ideas and inspirations stemming from choir. No other art form, no sport, no hobby, no business requires a group of people to execute a communal goal with just their voices. Join me, your host Beth Philemon, as I interview guests who are singers, teachers, conductors, instrumentalists, and community members. Together, we'll ask questions, seek understanding, and share insight from our experiences in life and in choir. You're listening to the Choir Baton podcast where we want to know-- what's your story?

Well, I am here with Lamar and Nyi Nyi, who are senior music education majors from Wingate University. And guys, why don't you just tell us a little bit about who you are. Give us a little introduction about yourselves.

Lamar Davis: Okay, well, I am Lamar, a senior music education student as she said. I'm originally from Beaufort, South Carolina, which is more near the coast. So our schools are definitely more western, near the Charlotte area. I'm a coastal beach boy, from the coast, and yeah, that's me. 

Nyi Nyi Myin: And I'm Nyi Nyi. I was originally born and raised in Burma before moving to Charlotte when I was 10. And I've been here ever since. I'm at Wingate studying music education and it’s senior year-- so excited.

Beth Philemon: So this is for Nyi Nyi. I've known you for several years, and I actually didn't know that you were born in Burma. 

Nyi Nyi Myin: Yeah, yeah.

Beth Philemon: I don't know a thing about Burma. So give me like-- I feel like a bad friend that I did not know this, but give me a little synopsis about Burma.

Nyi Nyi Myin: So it's a country in Southeast Asia between Thailand and India. It's a third world country, still developing. It has a lot of bad relationships in terms of government. It was ruled by a military coup for a couple of years. And now they're trying to change that, trying to make it more democratic. So my family actually came here as asylum seekers, we got that status. And then we moved here. My parents, they wanted a better education and better lifestyle for my brother and I, so that's why we moved here. 

Beth Philemon: Wow. So, what is the official language of Burma? 

Nyi Nyi Myin: Burmese. 

Beth Philemon: Okay, and I assume you speak it?

Nyi Nyi Myin: I do.

Beth Philemon: I have all the questions about that and I actually-- we'll save that for a little bit later because I want to talk about how your race and ethnicity is also going to influence your vision for your classroom and stuff like that too. But go ahead and give me a little bit of a personal history of choir and how you started singing and things like that.

Lamar Davis: So for me, I didn't actually start choir until my junior year of high school. Before that, when I got to middle school all I did was band because everyone in my family had done band and would just sort of assume I was going to do band, so I did band, I played trumpet all through middle school. But I always liked theater and I liked the idea. At that time I wanted to be an actor and do musicals and Broadway and all that stuff. So I always thought, no, I'll do band, but I'm gonna act one day, it’s all I want to do.

Beth Philemon: Did your middle school have a choir program? 

Lamar Davis: They did. They got one my seventh grade year. But I was already in band and committed to that so it was one of those things where the schedules-- it was hard to do both at the same time. Then I got to high school and started doing musicals, which is what got me singing and so it wasn’t until Sophomore year that I really wanted to do it. But again, scheduling made it hard with doing band and choir because at that time I became a drum major of the band so I needed to do band. So I couldn't actually fit in on the schedule, I couldn't fit in a choir class. So my junior year. And then I fell in love with it.

Beth Philemon: What was your primary instrument?

Lamar Davis: Well, I did trumpet in middle school and then baritone in high school. 

Beth Philemon: Okay. And you know, not that it's a game of favorites or what's better or not, but you are a choral music education major. So when did you see the light? When did you get saved in regards to-- I'm just kidding. I mean, that's a big thing, you were a drum major. And now you're a choral music ed major.

Lamar Davis: Yeah, I mean, because freshman year, I knew I wanted to teach music and I felt I was going to be a band director at that time

Beth Philemon: Freshman year of college or freshman year of high school?

Lamar Davis: High school. That's why I went out to be a drum major and being drum major, really that first year really was like, yep, this is what I want to do because I was really assisting with running the band, not just conducting. So, I got to do all these little things that would need it. I enjoyed that, I enjoyed the rehearsal process and I enjoyed competing and all this and just music in general. So I thought I was going to be a band director until junior year when I joined choir and felt myself-- and I still love band and all the band people of course. Band’s awesome. But for me, personally, I felt like because I was making the music from me and not blowing the air into an instrument that made the music there’s a different connection and realizing this is coming from my human body, like this music. So yeah, that in itself was what hooked me into choir and I realized this is what I want to do. This is what I want to get better at and help other people get better at.

Beth Philemon: Yeah. Cool.

Lamar Davis: So that's my testimony.

Beth Philemon: Yeah. Amen. Amen. Say it again for the people in the back. All right. Nyi Nyi?

Nyi Nyi Myin: So I started out playing in orchestra. I played Viola in sixth grade. And I continued that until my senior year of high school. And I didn't start singing until about the end of eighth grade, ninth grade year. And I started out singing with a program, a choral program here in Charlotte, North Carolina. It's a nonprofit organization program called the Choir School at St. Peter. It's a community choir with all the children around the Charlotte area and we'll meet once a week to rehearse. It is audition based. But that's where I received all my formal choral training and stuff like that.

Beth Philemon: So you never sang in high school?

Nyi Nyi Myin: No, I did. But that was not until junior year, joining a choir in high school. Prior to that it was just playing Viola and stuff like that. The first time when I joined the choir in high school, during my junior year, I made the North Carolina Honors Chorus. That year it was with Brad Holmes and it was just absolutely amazing. And that experience really led me to the possibility of finding a career in music and trying to teach music. Choral music specifically, instead of instrumental music or anything like that. Choral music, it just felt right. It just was home for me and I’ve just loved that ever since.

Beth Philemon: It's so interesting that you had that moment at North Carolina Honors Chorus, which for people that are listening to this that are not in North Carolina, North Carolina's Honors Chorus is what other state’s All State Choirs are. So North Carolina Honors Chorus here is the one where you audition and sight-read and you're placed in that, so it's the equivalent of the Texas All State or the Iowa All State, things like that. But so many times you hear that from people that that experience was really transformative for them. Did y'all know each other before Wingate?

Lamar Davis and Nyi Nyi Myin: No!

Beth Philemon: So I guess I should preface this also, they are roommates or they have been roommates. They're just now moving this weekend. Which is sad. 

Lamar Davis: Yeah, we were coming from literally two opposite sides of the state and yeah, I just I thought about that when we came because we just came from moving his stuff back to his house. And I was like, well, I'm leaving my brother.

Beth Philemon: Well, and honestly what a testament to how choral music brought you together at Wingate, right? Why did you choose Wingate? I mean, I think it is like the bomb.com. Were you looking at other schools, and you know, you don't have to be like, I was looking at this school and whatever, but what about thinking about people that might be in high school or in college and thinking about going into music? What were some determining factors for you?

Nyi Nyi Myin: Well, for me, I was one of those kids that applied to all the schools. If I got an email and they said free application I took that opportunity. So I definitely knew that I wanted to study music, specifically music education and choral music. So I narrowed it down to Furman University, University of North Carolina at Greensboro, Appalachian State and ECU. And I went there, auditioned, got accepted to all those places. But when it came down to deciding, for me it was more of a financial choice and also what I really wanted, which was a smaller school. A small setting. When I went to UNC it was just too big. It was very overwhelming. I mean, the people are nice, you know, all the professors and everything, but I was scared. But with Wingate, Dr. Potter, I knew him prior through conventions and stuff like that, he asked me to come visit him and he just makes it more personal for each of us. And I just fell in love with it and after hearing the choir and everything, it just worked out well for me, so that’s how I ended up there.

Beth Philemon: Lamar, how did you?

Lamar Davis: So, I applied to many places. And for me, what ended up happening was I was so worried about what I was going to do with my life and if I was going to be any good at doing music that this one and one other school were actually the only two auditions out of many that went well. So I thought, that narrows it down. And then yeah, it was when I came. I actually didn't visit the school, most people visit and you tour, you sit in on a choir or something, you know, you talk to professors. The only thing I had was my audition. And then I decided, partly because of transportation, it is four or five hours away from where I live. 

But it was the fact that, in that one audition day I felt like I was immediately a part of something-- I just walked in and was just embraced and really listened to and that's another thing, again, all the schools I applied to are great and everything, but it's one thing to be in an audition and be heard and then listened to. I think that I felt like when I was in there, I was being listened to instead of marked on a sheet and there's a bit of that. But yeah, and then like you said, meeting with Dr. Potter and talking with him to see how personable he is. And to see that carry over, in your first year when you come here and you've actually been here, see how personable he is and the entire staff and all the students, it's what sealed the deal.

Beth Philemon: Well, and you guys have been so active I know in your choral program, especially with ACDA and one of you is ACDA student chapter president, right? And the other one is choir president? I don't know, you both keep it spinning. 

Nyi Nyi Myin: Lamar, he was the choir president last year, for the University Singers, but we're both active members in the ACDA chapter at school.

Beth Philemon: Awesome. Awesome. Well, you are coming up in a pivotal point in your career here as a student, as a choral ed major, and that is…

Lamar Davis and Nyi Nyi Myin: Student teaching!

Beth Philemon: So, all the things I have questions about, tell us a little bit about who you’re student teaching with and what your student teaching experience is going to be-- like in regards to, do you have the same placement the whole time, how long it is, all the things.

Lamar Davis: For me, I am at Northwest School of the Arts in Charlotte, Charlotte-Mecklenburg schools. And I'm with Ms. Stephanie Madsen and she's at the high school level, and they have, it's like a double placement, basically because they're both a high school/middle school in the School of Arts. So the high school placement is Stephanie Madsen, and the middle school placement is Mr. Aaron Lafreniere. And I think mine is special in the fact that the middle and high school are there together so I don't actually have a dual placement. So I'm there the entire time.

Nyi Nyi Myin: So my placement I'm at for the half of the first semester is with Ms. Patty Fayssoux, she's at Cramerton Middle in Gaston County. And for my high school placement I’m with Mr. Peter Haley from East Gaston High School. And Mr. Haley is also a Wingate alum. 

Beth Philemon: And his school is also Dr. Potter’s school right? Dr. Potter taught there too.

Nyi Nyi Myin: Dr. Potter taught there for a good bit, so a lot of good choral relation in that area. 

Beth Philemon: So what ensembles are you going to be working with in these placements?

Nyi Nyi Myin: So for mine, for middle school she wants me to work with especially the sixth grade  treble choir. But you know, I'm still going to have the opportunity to work with other groups as well. For the high school with Mr. Haley, I think he wants me to be involved in as much as I can, you know, with all the choral groups he has at his school. He has a beginning choir, then a sophomore choir and junior/seniors, they have a big mix chamber ensemble.

Lamar Davis: I don’t remember it off the top of my head. I know my schedule might actually be kind of weird too, because, since I'm there the entire time and they have their A day/B day schedules and whatnot, I'll be going back and forth between classes. So for middle school, I have the seventh grade chorus. And I think the theory I have at the middle school level as well.

Beth Philemon: Oh cool, so it's not just choir, you're going to teach some theory.

Lamar Davis: Yeah, yeah. And yeah, they said that they were really adamant about me getting that since I’ll have to teach theory at some point.

And then for the high school, I am with the men's chorus. I think the beginning part, and there’s an interesting thing there. There’s a recital, seminar class, where it's just like solo singing. 

Beth Philemon: Oh, that's cool. 

Lamar Davis: I don’t really know how that works yet, but we'll figure it out.

Beth Philemon: Yeah. All right. So I have a lot of questions-- we'll start positively first, what are you most excited about in student teaching, most looking forward to with it all?

Nyi Nyi Myin: I think for me it’s just getting up there and-- we've been learning so much in class like we're actually ready to start applying that knowledge that we've been getting.

Lamar Davis: For anyone who's ever been in a senior music ed course, and obviously there you're taking high school methods something and you're sitting down, you're taking notes. You can see the like, not this thing or anything like that. Like the want to be in a classroom at that point you’re just like, yes, yes, can we go now? You get to, by the end of that semester, you're like, I'm ready to do this. Yes. So yeah, just doing it is what I’m most looking forward to.

Beth Philemon: All right, what are you most nervous or apprehensive about within this experience? Well, are you nervous? I mean, you know, you might not be nervous too.

Lamar Davis: Yeah, totally. Completely nervous.

Beth Philemon: Good. I think that's good, it says you care. And let me too say why I think I'm asking this question. And I know it's a personal question. I just kind of threw it on here. But I think it's so important for people to know, well, every music teacher has been through this right? So you're not alone with that. And then other future music educators that either are going into student teaching or going to be student teaching soon, it's so comforting to know that you're not alone.

Lamar Davis: And I think the only thing that makes it hard is because you will always know that you’re nervous, it's just hard to always pinpoint what it is. I'm nervous now, especially with something as broad and as long-term as this, it’s hard to pinpoint the specific things that make you nervous. For me, I think of just not doing as good of a job in terms of presenting myself. I know the information like the back of my hand. I've been studying it for forever now, but how do I now give it back to students and make sure that they're receiving it. And that I'm doing it right and I'm doing it well, that's the big thing, you know, cuz I was talking about this actually over Christmas because, of course, everyone at home, you know, they asked the same question, how are you feeling? Are you excited? 

I think it's interesting because it's hard to go into something like this out of college, where I feel like student teaching is expecting to fail at something. There's some things that I'm just going to fail and be weak at. And it's scary because college to me is a place that’s designed around your imperfection and designed around not necessarily your strengths, but these are your weaknesses, not to make you feel weak or inferior, but to show you so that you can strengthen this. That's what I found, specifically, especially with music. Definitely teaching. So now that those weaknesses are going to be put to the test, and another teacher is going to have to then exploit those as well. And I'll learn, this doesn't work well with students. So this is a weakness, you know, finding those weaknesses with anyone I feel like it's something that's really hard to deal with.

Nyi Nyi Myin: And I feel like when we're student teaching, yeah, even though we have our host teacher as a guide we don't really know what we're really getting into. And, you know, for me, failure-- I have a hard time accepting that personally, especially with music. You want the best that you can be but at the same time, you have to gain experience and fail in order to be better and stuff like that. And another thing about the edTPA...

Beth Philemon: Oh yeah, you guys have that thing you have to do.

Nyi Nyi Myin: That's another thing that… Well, what did they say? They were like, still testing it out?

Lamar Damis: Yeah, for North Carolina it's still gonna be a trial year. So technically, our scores aren’t our final grades or anything, it’s just a test run still.

Beth Philemon: So edTPA, and correct me if I'm wrong, because my student teacher last year had to do it, it's basically like a portfolio that you have to show how you are meeting standards and reflecting on them and lesson implementation and things like that. And Shane, the student teacher I had, explained to me it's kind of set up to look like the portfolio portions of the National Board Certification teacher thing to align within that. And yeah, you’re right, it's nice that your scores kind of won't matter. But again, being the students that you are, even if it's not a score that matters, you still want to do really well.

Lamar Davis: I want to say while I have you right now, by the way, I don't know if you want this broadcasted, but congratulations!

Beth Philemon: Thanks, guys... man.

Lamar Davis: I mean, of course you would.

Beth Philemon: Well, that's the crazy thing about it is you know, you just never know and it's an obscure sort of thing that you're writing on and you go through waves of being like, I suck at teaching. I am the worst teacher ever. Why? How? And then be like, I totally got this, and you just ride those waves throughout the process. So I guess you're doing something similar and I can say that when you go through those waves, know that you're not alone. 

But you're both hitting on something that I think is just really key and Lamar, I have never thought about it before-- we say college is really designed around your weaknesses and to show you those, and it's a mindset that I'm really exploring. I see so much in what we do, because we want that right. We want to see, we want to be aware of our weaknesses and to grow on those, but sometimes I think we are, it's to a detriment, we forget to compliment ourselves, honestly. And to believe in ourselves in certain ways.

Lamar Davis: Yeah, definitely for me, that's something I've really been working on since I've been in college. I'm in counseling. And just trying to find motivation and things, and it gets to be so-- especially with music, when you're studying and you're in choir and you're in voice lessons and diction classes and all these different things, you have to do teaching modules when you're not teaching. It always comes back to, what is it that we say? It's like 80:20 you know, 20% compliment, 80% critique. And dealing with the 80% is always the hardest thing and I found, I don't remember where it was, but sometime someone said the balance of imperfection where understanding that you are human and that being imperfect is expected and okay and needed to grow. But not feeling like that imperfection gets you down on the other side and makes you feel like you're less than or not good which, for any musician, you go on stage and you don't give your best, you'll see some of them come off and it’s like, eh that happened and some of them are coming off and they're balling and you're like, it's not that big of a deal, but at the same time, to them it is. 

Because imperfection is something that we've learned to exploit and to see, no matter if the rest of the three minutes of the song was amazing, the two seconds that the high note didn't come out like it was supposed to is what's going to be playing over and over in our heads because that 80% to me has been so ingrained, which is something that I didn't want to ever lose while I was learning throughout my four years was the idea of, I don't, and I know you have like a very choir based audience so this is not gonna sound great, but I don't like that, I want a-- give me 60:40, give me 55:45, because I feel like especially for middle and high schools and for me personally, as someone who likes students who are coming from rough backgrounds or those type of emotional lives, I want them to feel that positivity, much more than that 80% that we feel is needed to make things better. Yes, I can address that all I want but I need them to get more of this positivity and feel like they are enjoying it. 

Beth Philemon: I know, well and you hit the nail on the head though, I think that's the cool thing too about choir and that's where, I honestly hope people will potentially listen to this that aren't even involved in choir because at the end of the day, this is why you went into this. We sing with our bodies, with our voices, there is no other more personal way of music making then in singing. And so these fears of failure and of inadequacies and focusing on the ratio of good to bad and better and worse is all the more personal and all the more relevant in what we do every single day.

It's just important to consider that-- so I'm interested to see when you go into your teaching and even within your student work is to flip that ratio, kind of what you were saying have more 20% critique and 80% confidence-building and positivity. One thing that I've really been working on with my students are these “I am” statements or saying things as if they've already happened. When I breathe, I sing. I sing that high note without tension. And the more we begin to actually believe that and verbalize it instead of, I hope I can sing this high note without tension or I hope I remember to breathe when I sing. It changes our sound and it's an empowerment thing. And yes, it works in singing, but it also works in life. So I'm excited for you to get to play with that in the classroom.

Lamar Davis: And I think the idea of flipping it sometimes can be scary for teachers, especially the teacher that wants that superior because they've got to get them to work on, what makes it better? Rather than, why is it good already? So that can be hard. I don’t remember who I was talking with about this, I think it was my last placement. I've been in placements, the past three field experience placements where every now and again you just observe or whatever, they've been in programs that are, you know, not at their peak, but growing specifically because they are programs placed in areas of kids with, Title One and rough backgrounds or rough home lives. And the teachers find that the emotional connection to the teacher and to the music, being in music itself, it's far more important to them than worrying about making sure every little thing is perfect. 

And I thought that was an interesting thing, because we would be talking and my third experience teacher was like, I haven't been to a NAfME or an ACDA in awhile and she said, if you look around a lot of teachers from our kinds of schools aren't. And it's not because we don't want to go and we don't want to grow as teachers. But it's because we're not there yet. And it made me think about the idea that a lot of our sessions and a lot of our things are really, you know, geared towards that 80% and trying to figure out how we can be better at finding the weaknesses and better at improving the weaknesses. But focusing on the positive, to me, is something that those students I’ve seen really connect with, and that in itself is enough for them to push to make it even better, because they're hearing just how much they're getting better. And so, yeah, I'm excited about that too, obviously.

Beth Philemon: But that's such an interesting and true statement, though, about where our conferences lie is focusing on that 80%, focusing on making the negative better instead of celebrating the good that's happening.

Lamar Davis: Yeah, I mean, I hadn't thought about it. So I was in those schools and saw it from that side.

Beth Philemon: Absolutely. So you're black, and you're Burmese, and you’re men. And I really struggle with wanting to talk about difference, like wanting to talk about ethnicity and race and I'm always afraid I'm going to say the wrong thing or do the wrong thing, especially because I'm white. Do you, and if you do, how, envision yourself using your cultural identities? Is that like, one of the keywords that people use now? Does that make me sound… I'm really trying. So how do you plan on, how do you envision that being a part of your classroom climate? Does that make sense? 

Lamar Davis and Nyi Nyi Myin: Yeah, yeah.

Lamar Davis: I mean, for a lot of choir it's about finding my sense of self and that comes from understanding not just who you are, but who everyone else is around you and understanding that just how individual everyone is, you know, that idea of, this is where I come from, this is my background, there is no one else in the world that has this specific background and has these specific impacts and these affections and cares and dislikes and likes and I am me because of these specific reasons. So, I don't know, I feel like that's what I plan to bring culturally to it, by bringing who I am, in my uniqueness and trying to encourage that in other students, no matter what, and it's like, yeah, I'm black and I've had these experiences. I've had that experience. I haven't had this experience. I haven't done this, but I like this and I still like this just like you, being white, you know? And we sing, all of us!

Beth Philemon: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Nyi Nyi Myin: And I feel like just to use our background as a tool to create an environment that's welcoming, accepting, and then just to be open and be willing to talk about any issues and stuff like that. And just trying to explain it or give a better understanding of if someone doesn't really know about a certain culture or topic or anything like that. So you are kind of like the representative, but at the same time you want it to be a positive experience for everyone. And just being nice and if you have questions, don't be afraid to ask, it doesn't hurt, rather than just judging it from your first impression or whatever.

Beth Philemon: I just find in the classroom, I bring my gender into what I'm teaching so much and particularly in the classroom it has made me very aware of sometimes how I react to female students versus how I react to male students, whether it's the same or different. And then expectations that sometimes I didn't realize that I've had, I'm like, bleh, I have this and I can change this, be it good or bad or just observations or how much I'm able to pull from my female students and pull from the male students. And yeah, so I'm excited. You don't know this, but we're going to talk again, either midway through or end of the way through your student teaching experience and this would be something I'm interested to come back to because it's also just such a big point of conversation within our schools and within our teaching is who you are and how you bring that background and that experience to the students you teach. 

Beth Philemon: Hey guys, I just wanted to take a quick moment from our interview with Lamar and Nyi Nyi and remind you about @ChoirBaton on Instagram. Choir Baton really started as an Instagram takeover account, a place where different choir directors, choir singers, choir managers could sign up and show us a day in the life of your choral music making experience. You can either follow the account and just check out what other awesome choirs are doing. Or even better, click the link in the bio or go to choirbaton.com/holdthechoirbaton and sign up to hold the Choir Baton or to host the account for a day. You'll get an email from me once you sign up that will give you an idea of different days that we have available. And when it comes around to your day, you get an email from me with password information. And that's it, you sign in and start posting. It's super easy, super fun and a really, truly amazing, great way to connect with our choir community. 

You know, when you join a choir, when you're a part of choral music making, you really are a part of not just that one entity, you are a part of a greater community of people that are passionate about making not just great music, but music with our voices and Choir Baton is designed to showcase and celebrate this and ultimately to remind us that when you're a part of a choir, you're a part of a community so much larger than you could ever imagine. So go now during this quick break, log into Instagram, go to Choir Baton, make sure you're following, turn on post notifications and then if you really want to be the ultimate Choir Baton enthusiast, sign up to hold the Choir Baton with the link in the bio or choirbaton.com/holdthechoirbaton. And now, back to the rest of our interview with Lamar and Nyi Nyi.

Beth Philemon: Reflecting back, you're almost done, we'll check in about student teaching and how it's all going and pros and cons. Oh, I do have this. What is something that you're excited to work with a choir on, you know, is it-- Are you excited about maybe literacy, teaching a piece from start to finish? Are you excited about warm ups? Are you excited about working on sight reading, or are you excited about working on conducting or phrasing or it's like-- is there one of those components that you are just totally stoked to work on? 

Lamar Davis and Nyi Nyi Myin: All of the above!

Lamar Davis: No, I’ll try to pick one. Ever since I was a junior when I decided to be bold and take a not required pedagogy class, which I don't understand why it's not required because at the beginning, I'm like, yeah, we need this. After taking that pedagogy class, I was like, ah, this is amazing. So although I have pedagogical tools I got from that I'm excited to really just experiment with that and see how it works in high school voices and in the choral aspect because it came from-- the reason why it wasn't required is because it came from a more soloistic singing perspective for the performance majors, mostly. But taking that and putting it in the choir, first of all, I think you’d agree, I think is that it helps so much when you're like listening to choirs and whatnot. And, of course, most everyone knows this, but that's what I'm excited about, actually putting to work the pedagogical aspect.

Beth Philemon: Awesome. Nyi Nyi? 

Nyi Nyi Myin: I'm excited with literally everything. But you know I'm a nerd. So especially with history and stuff like that. I love when you know that composers wrote this because of this event or how they  described this feeling or emotion using this type of chord or structure in this. It's all very nerdy, but I wish that my students have the opportunity and the knowledge of reading music just, that's the middle C and I can find it here on the piano. I think I'll be very happy with that if any of my students can do that.

Beth Philemon: Do you have any tips for students that are going into college considering becoming a music education major or even a music major, things to be aware of, things to look for, etc.

Nyi Nyi Myin: Know the piano! Any piano skills will be helpful so you can get a head start.

Lamar Davis: I think, being the emotional person I am, my biggest thing is figure out what, it can be general or whatever, but figure out what makes you you. Hold on to that because it's very easy to feel overwhelmed and feel like there's a lot coming at you and that you have to sort of conform yourself to fit a music mode or a music educator mode or performer mode. So I feel like, stay true to who you are and let that ride you. And learn to embrace failure. 

Beth Philemon: Embracing failure is so stinking hard-- hard. but I love that you said, you know, you mentioned that you've done counseling when you're in school. I think it's really important, especially in college because there's counselors on campus, when I was in graduate school I went, and then I still go to someone now and it is one of the best things that you can do for yourself. 

Lamar Davis: It helps with that sense of self. 

Beth Philemon: And the stronger that we are as people, makes us stronger teachers as well. I know the times that I've struggled the most as a teacher has been times when I've struggled the most as a person. And particularly, I feel like as a choral education major, so much of what we do is tied into it. I mean, the repertoire that we pick even is something that resonates with us personally. And that is a vulnerable state as well. When I first started teaching, I was like, so excited to just be able to pick rep and songs that I wanted to do. And now the older that I get, I'm like, oh crap, this is vulnerable, I hope they like this! The students, the parents, the community. Yeah, there's a lot that goes into it. 

Well, that kind of leads into some of my last closing questions. It’s just going to be some overviews and the first question is so cliche: What is your most favorite choir piece to have ever sung or performed? Doesn't have to be the favorite, but what's something that rocks you to your core?

Nyi Nyi Myin: You mean in college?

Beth Philemon: Ever.

Lamar Davis: I have two, one that I performed and one I didn’t perform but I really like. The one I didn’t perform that I really like, it’s the one that's coming quickest. And it's Stacey Gibbs, Great God Almighty. I love that piece. Love it. Love it. Love it. Um, and one I did perform.. gosh, dang it. 

I think the favorite that I performed is probably Indodana by Michael Barrett.

Beth Philemon: That's the one with the hand raise, right?

Lamar Davis: Yeah, I cry every time! 

Beth Philemon: Yeah, that's a cool piece. Nyi Nyi?

Nyi Nyi Myin: For me, one of my all time favorite pieces, well it's a mass, by-- I don't know how to pronounce it, but it's by Gyorgy Orban. He wrote this one mass for treble voices. It's called Mass No. 6. I've never performed it, but I've heard it performed several times. And that's one piece that I definitely want to do when I get my own choir, if they can do it. Another piece I performed is called I Will Lift Mine Eyes, a setting of Psalm 121 by Jake Runestad. We performed that on our tour two years ago. The text and the music, it just speaks for itself. And what makes it more special, we were touring in Charleston, South Carolina and we actually performed it right outside that church, Emanuel AME, where they had that shooting a few years ago. And it was amazing. 

Beth Philemon: Okay, this next one is really serious. What's your favorite food?

Lamar Davis: My favorite food is a good lasagna.

Nyi Nyi Myin: I love anything that's Asian-- sushi, pho, boba tea, you name it. I'm not a picky eater, so I'll eat anything but Asian is like my go to place. Not like Americanized Asian, but authentic Asian.

Beth Philemon: Have you seen crazy rich Asians?

Nyi Nyi Myin: No, I have not.

Beth Philemon: I cried. I cried. I'm just gonna say, I just watched it a couple days ago. It was so good. I highly, highly recommend. Okay, next question. What is your favorite non-choir piece of music? That’s a super broad question, in my mind it’s like my go-to hype song. I love me some Usher. You turn that song on and I-- from the windows to the wall I get so excited. So what is yours? 

Lamar Davis: Of course it changes, but right now, and for a while now actually, I think my go to has been Alex Newell’s album, he's the guy from Glee, the Unique guy from glee. He made an album that's got some really cool, pop, funky type songs. So one of the songs that I listen to now is This Ain’t Over by Alex Newell. He's really good, I think you’ll like it.

Nyi Nyi Myin: It's a song called Mayday. It's by an artist called Cam. She's a country folk song artist. You should listen to it. 

Lamar Davis: Every Sunday on the way to church.

Beth Philemon: Okay, I love it, done, I got me some new Spotify tunes to throw down. Alright, here's the next one. Where, how, in what do you find inspiration? Like what inspires you? Or is there a mantra that you have that inspires you? Something like that.

Lamar Davis: This one I stole from another Broadway performer named Sierra Boggess. She does this every day and before every performance. So I say to myself before every performance, it is, “you are enough. You are so enough. It is unbelievable how enough you are.” I love it. 

Nyi Nyi Myin: For me, I don't know, I find inspiration going to a conference or reading something or whatever, just waking up each morning and being thankful for just being alive I guess. That's my inspiration, you're making today the best that I can for every day.

Beth Philemon: All right, this is the most important question of all and if you know me, you're not surprised and you both know me very well. How do you take your coffee? What's your coffee order?

Lamar Davis: If it’s Starbucks I'm getting-- well, it's always lattes I should say. I’m a latte person, with less sweetener, less sugar. I need to taste the coffee a little bit more. So sometimes it's a macchiato day so I can get a good shot in there.

Nyi Nyi Myin: For me, it's depending on the day. The green tea latte, or was that coconut? Coconut milk and ground beans, something from vanilla beans... something.

Lamar Davis: Oh, and if it's early in the morning then I can do just straight black with like, three tablespoons of sugar. That's all I need.

Nyi Nyi Myin: I need half and half and a lot of half and half. Yeah, I like it creamy.

Lamar Davis: I don't remember yours. What is your way of coffee?

Beth Philemon: I just drink my coffee black. I did a whole 30 about two years ago and when you do a whole 30 you can't have creamer or sugar or you can have this like crappy, it's not crappy, but you can do this almond stuff. And I just started drinking it black. And now, this is really disgusting, but now like if I buy a venti Starbucks coffee or something, I can drink it the whole day and the milk never goes bad. Or this is really sad, but like there is still some left in my cup today from, or in my car today, from my venti coffee of yesterday, and I just poured it into my coffee, it's not gonna go bad in 24 hours or so. #TeacherLife and saving all those dollars.

Okay, well listen, I freaking love you guys so much. I am stoked to see what the semester holds for you. You know, one of my, goodness, I loved my student teaching experience. And I loved having a student teacher and so I'm just hoping this is a really positive experience. Also, I think it'd be fun too if we get Stephanie to join us for one. And also Peter, for another point, just so we can continue to talk about this. 

Lamar Davis: I’ll tell you everything I did wrong!

Beth Philemon: Yep, you're gonna mess up. I mean, I know you know that. Yeah, and because you'll continue to mess up. I mean, I mess up all the time. And it's how you recover from the mess ups. But one thing you said that you're most aware of, is how you portray yourself to your students when you go and ensuring that you can convey to them that you know what you're talking about. And I just want to encourage you to say, mentally say to yourself, like what the Broadway singer says, “that I am enough, I'm more than enough”, like to say that to yourself, I am a great teacher. I know my content. I'm a great teacher. And so when we begin to say those doubtful, I'm afraid I'm gonna mess up here. I'm afraid I'm gonna mess it up here. It's a brain wiring thing. And then it takes us down another road that we don't want to. 

Okay, last thing, if people want to follow you or catch up with you, I don't know if you have private accounts if you want, or anyone to reach out to you or they have questions or anything like that. Do you want to share any way to follow you and keep up with this? Or are you gonna stay private?

Nyi Nyi Myin: Yeah, I'm happy to share! You can find me on Facebook at Nyi Nyi Myin. My Insta is all in one word, nyinyimyin and so that's all I have, Facebook and Insta.

Lamar Davis: Well yes, I'm on Facebook. It’s Trevor Lamar Davis, and also on Instagram, same handle.

Beth Philemon: Thank you guys so much, and keep me up to date as to how things are going, you know, whatever you need, let me know. And you guys have just been such an encouragement to me, as well. It's been really fun to connect with you guys and your excitement for what you do is palpable, and it’s just cool. Bye, guys. Thanks again. 

Lamar Davis and Nyi Nyi Myin: Bye!

Beth Philemon: I so enjoyed hearing about Lamar and Nyi Nyi’s origins to choir music. I was encouraged and inspired by why and how they decided to major in choral music education. And really, I'm still thinking about this 20% versus 80% thing of how we are addressing areas that we need to improve in our life versus areas that we are doing well. And I think that's a really big concept, particularly in today's society. I know that it's something I not only address personally, but I'm beginning to think of how I address it with my student singers as well. 

Thanks so much for listening in to this week's episode. If you have not done so already, I would love if you would subscribe to the Choir Baton podcast. And if you really like what you're hearing here, a review would be amazing. Let us know what you think, let others know what you're enjoying about this and you can always send me an email at [email protected] and let me know especially if you have any other ideas or areas that you'd like to discuss. I'm so excited to continue these conversations with you and unbelievably grateful that you took the time to listen and be a part of these conversations as well. Take care!